twonines
LIMERICUS
Absolutely spot on about PrPr`s writing.
Your jaundiced views about Amanda,however, will at least allow us to read about your next little session with Mr. Ng with a relatively clear conscience!
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Imprisonment and Execution in Modern Singapore Part III of Barb's Singapore Saga
- Thread starter Praefectus Praetorio
- Start date
Your jaundiced views about Amanda,however, will at least allow us to read about your next little session with Mr. Ng with a relatively clear conscience!
Praefectus Praetorio
R.I.P. Brother of the Quill
It will be further clarified in the next few postings, but a little on the Parliamentary Guards:
They have exclusive jurisdiction (excluding drug offenses) within the Parliament, Building, Parliament Square, and a few other Parliament controlled places. Therefore, a rape committed within their area is their case. However, they rarely have violent crimes to investigate, and having CNB involved complicates things. So they asked the Police for an experienced detective. Frost, as detective emeritus was able to assign himself when he heard the victim was related to the Moore case.
The Guards are like a cross between the Yeoman Warders (Beefeaters) and the Household Cavalry - for British readers; or The Secret Service and the Capitol Police for American Readers.
They have exclusive jurisdiction (excluding drug offenses) within the Parliament, Building, Parliament Square, and a few other Parliament controlled places. Therefore, a rape committed within their area is their case. However, they rarely have violent crimes to investigate, and having CNB involved complicates things. So they asked the Police for an experienced detective. Frost, as detective emeritus was able to assign himself when he heard the victim was related to the Moore case.
The Guards are like a cross between the Yeoman Warders (Beefeaters) and the Household Cavalry - for British readers; or The Secret Service and the Capitol Police for American Readers.
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momo2000
Spectator
I just really hope that Amanda wont have to share Barbara's faith. That poor thing. Like, reading the last few chapters made me feel genuinely worried and uncomfortable. So kudos to PrPr. I've never thought that an erotic story could be written well enough to make me care about characters so much. So yeah, please find a way to go easy on Amanda.
momo2000
Spectator
Sorry, somehow sent an unwanted attachment and consequently deleted my message in a shot circuit reaction lol. (Preview your messages before posting, guys!)
Originally I was going to give some - hopefully - funny answer about "the prisoner getting cheeky again" yadda yadda yadda. But your question got me thinking. Why do I want to see one character suffer and die for the audience's enjoyment but root for the other one when the same seems to be inbound for her? Like it is not that Barbara is a hateable character like for example Jimmy Rodgers from this story or Joffrey Baratheon from "A song of ice and fire". Because when a character is hateable, I feel like their death is justified. I don't think that for Barbara, yet I fail to feel empathy for her in the same way that I do for Amanda. Now, here comes my theory on why:
When it comes to this kind of stories, one usually knows who is gonna be the final "victim". The one character to suffer and die eventually. It's the same here, as a reader, I know right from the start what Barbara's final fate is going to be. That's why I don't feel a lot of suspension because I already know the outcome of the struggle. In other circumstances this would be considered bad storytelling, but it is of course in the nature of this forum and the genre of this story that the audience knows what is going to happen to some degree. Therefore I don't start caring for Barb as a character all too much because I know that ultimately, she is there for enjoyment and her struggle is effortless.
Not so for Amanda. She hasn't been marked as the victim right from the start. She is a character that we get introduced to as a normal person and that we get to see as a human being. That is why I as the reader connect much more to Amanda emotionally. Additionally, there is the point that we don't know Amanda's ultimate fate in advance. This means that there is an actual curve of suspense because of how much she still has to loose in the reader's eyes. And this suspense is strong enough that I personally have to force myself to keep reading because I'm afraid of what is going to happen next, as Amanda seems to get consumed by an unjust apparatus of logistics and law.
TLDR: We know what is going to happen to Barb and consequently we don't connect to and root for her since she is the mandatory victim of the story.
Edit: On rereading this, I get the feeling that this might be seen as critical of PrPr's writing. If so, that is not what I mean! The very fact how much I personally care about Amanda proves to me how good of a writer PrPr is. It is in the nature of an erotic snuff story that the audience knows that the "protagonist" is going to be killed eventually.
How come SHE gets all the sympathy here? No fair!
Originally I was going to give some - hopefully - funny answer about "the prisoner getting cheeky again" yadda yadda yadda. But your question got me thinking. Why do I want to see one character suffer and die for the audience's enjoyment but root for the other one when the same seems to be inbound for her? Like it is not that Barbara is a hateable character like for example Jimmy Rodgers from this story or Joffrey Baratheon from "A song of ice and fire". Because when a character is hateable, I feel like their death is justified. I don't think that for Barbara, yet I fail to feel empathy for her in the same way that I do for Amanda. Now, here comes my theory on why:
When it comes to this kind of stories, one usually knows who is gonna be the final "victim". The one character to suffer and die eventually. It's the same here, as a reader, I know right from the start what Barbara's final fate is going to be. That's why I don't feel a lot of suspension because I already know the outcome of the struggle. In other circumstances this would be considered bad storytelling, but it is of course in the nature of this forum and the genre of this story that the audience knows what is going to happen to some degree. Therefore I don't start caring for Barb as a character all too much because I know that ultimately, she is there for enjoyment and her struggle is effortless.
Not so for Amanda. She hasn't been marked as the victim right from the start. She is a character that we get introduced to as a normal person and that we get to see as a human being. That is why I as the reader connect much more to Amanda emotionally. Additionally, there is the point that we don't know Amanda's ultimate fate in advance. This means that there is an actual curve of suspense because of how much she still has to loose in the reader's eyes. And this suspense is strong enough that I personally have to force myself to keep reading because I'm afraid of what is going to happen next, as Amanda seems to get consumed by an unjust apparatus of logistics and law.
TLDR: We know what is going to happen to Barb and consequently we don't connect to and root for her since she is the mandatory victim of the story.
Edit: On rereading this, I get the feeling that this might be seen as critical of PrPr's writing. If so, that is not what I mean! The very fact how much I personally care about Amanda proves to me how good of a writer PrPr is. It is in the nature of an erotic snuff story that the audience knows that the "protagonist" is going to be killed eventually.
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Praefectus Praetorio
R.I.P. Brother of the Quill
Thank you, @momo1995 , for your thoughtful comments. You have inspired me to post this rambling and excessively long comment. All feel free to ignore it.
In my writing, I feel very like a comment made many years ago by Bob Dylan (Though I don’t dream of writing on his level). “I don’t write the songs. They are there before me, and I just copy them down.”
Often, I don’t seem to control the plot: it controls me. I introduced Amanda in Singapore II as a foil for Barbara, someone for her to be jealous of and make rude remarks about. Barb’s dislike of cheerleaders is well known, and the humorous side of her character is most evident in her fits of jealously (“It’s all about Barbara!”). Once Amanda was invented, she was an obvious romantic interest for Jeffrey (who has all the beautiful girls throw themselves at him) and had a role in helping with Barbara’s defense. After introducing an inexperienced 19-year old, sexy girl, it was fun to contrast her with the mature 36-year-old sexy Barbara.
@Barbaria1 's catty comments encouraged a more and more sympathetic portrayal of Amanda. Somewhere along the way, without planning it, I transformed Amanda Jones into a kind of little Nell Trent (@Migoz2 will know what I mean - however, "almost fourteen" Nell would result in me being banned from CF) of the story. I’m afraid that all the buildup of her innocent virtue probably induced me to make her a victim of those two brutes.
However, I don’t want my readers to misunderstand my feelings. As I was writing a full three posts worth of Amanda’s brutal assault and rape (not to mention Jimmy's earlier disgusting actions at the reception), I was disturbed. It was evil and wrong! I had confessed this before to a friend who tried to help by saying, it’s just fiction. And, of course, none of it was worse than countless stories on CF. That is true. I am proud of what I wrote. But please know that I felt as bad for Amanda as any of you did. Remember, she is my creation! I should also mention that I have had similar feelings over some of the terrors I have put (and will put) Barbara through - even though she makes such a nice victim, and the person she’s modeled on is a cruxgirl who enjoys such stories.
As to Amanda's future (and Barbara’s?), time will tell. I can share my “philosophy” of the Singapore Trilogy (in three or four parts?). While Barbara, in the beginning, got herself in trouble by humorous character flaws, she is now caught up in a system and a culture that inexorably drags her towards a horrible fate, while torturing her on the way. The overarching theme is the hidden corruption in the society, renowned for its efficiency and low crime rate, leading to a kind of Manichean world of powerful forces of darkness and overwhelmed fighters for the light – such as Frost, Hodges, and Amanda. I.e., a normal CF story world. In this world, the weak and innocent are always in peril, while the Queen of Evil (RBG) always gets her way.
BTW, I planned Jimmy’s heart attack death weeks ago based on a reader suggestion (sorry, I can’t remember who to credit) that he die while having intercourse with Barb. I did not steal the idea from an excellent other story that recently concluded on CF.
Sorry for running on. Now back to regular programming.
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With writers and readers as thoughtful as PrPr and Momo, as well as many others who write and comment here on this thread and elsewhere on CF, I feel enormously proud to be a member of this little dedicated community of scribblers and readers.
That being said, I find that I cannot bring myself to scale back my contempt for Amanda ... not even a little. Just saying.
momo2000
Spectator
Thank you so much, Barbaria. On a different note, I don't think that I ever disliked a character as strongly as Rodgers. Even to a degree where I felt sympathy with Mamat for having to deal with him. Like I was literally rummaging through my bookshelf a moment ago, trying to remember if I ever disliked a character more than him. And honestly there aren't many that I'd put on the same level as him except maybe Captain Bligh (Mutiny on the Bounty) or Phistomefel Smeik (The antagonist of a German novel called "Die Stadt der Träumenden Bücher" (eng. The city of dreaming books)). And while I don't wanna come of as the guy who tries to get people to like him through praise, I feel this is yet another sign of how well executed (no pun intended) this story is. Then again, I am a pretty emotional reader so I might not be representative for the general populace.
Edit: Just noticed that I misspelled Captain Bligh. Shame on me!
Edit: Just noticed that I misspelled Captain Bligh. Shame on me!
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Praefectus Praetorio
R.I.P. Brother of the Quill
I really was divided on whether to kill Jimmy at this point. He deserved it, of course, and made it a great scene. But when you have such a deliciously despicable character as Jimmy, you are tempted to hold him over even to the sequel to exploit your readers' hatred. Always remember - love is powerful, but hate is more powerful!
But I still have RBG, Josephine, Mamat, Imran, and the oh-so-muscular Ng.
Praefectus Praetorio
R.I.P. Brother of the Quill
Good Lord! I'm surrounded by the soft-hearted! All in favor of one of those sappy ending like I put on Rebecca, raise your hankies.
Fossy
SEXPIOGENTUS
Suffer and survive ... me too
Fossy
SEXPIOGENTUS
Reading the comments from @momo1995 and @Praefectus Praetorio followed by @Barbaria1's words, I too feel like we have a wonderful little community here. Feeling empathy with and pity for the characters you write about (as in PrPr's case) is a good thing for sure. But, whilst feeling the emotion is good, I don't think we need to feel bad for writing scenes such as 'rape of Amanda'. This is fictional fantasy and as such reflects the 'thing' we indulge ourselves with. So keep on writing from the heart PrPr, Windar, Barb and the excellent others who do the same ... but please don't spare the fetish!
settantuno
MUTUS PICTOR
My thoughts on the stories of cruxforums.
A child who plays with toy soldiers does not like war: he plays with imagination.
The toy soldiers fall and then relive in another game.
I think: those who have no imagination is much more dangerous than those who have imagination (because they could act before imagining the consequences).
A child who plays with toy soldiers does not like war: he plays with imagination.
The toy soldiers fall and then relive in another game.
I think: those who have no imagination is much more dangerous than those who have imagination (because they could act before imagining the consequences).
momo2000
Spectator
I think that sums it up very nicely. There is an old revolutionist Song from Germany called Die Gedanken sind Frei („Thoughts can’t be chained“ For the lack of a better translation. And In my opinion it fits pretty nicely here, because what we do is as you said, just fantasy.
Oh and btw, I might be a softy but not to that degree, PrPr. I came here to see Barb go all the way so I personally would be opposed to a happy end. But besides my personal preference, I also think that saving Barb would somehow harm the overarching theme of an unjust but all-powerful system. Then again, unexpectedly reversing the theme to something like „the good can win against even the greatest evil“ could be equally powerful from a storytelling standpoint. I‘n the end it comes down to the author‘s choice.
Migoz2
Senator
As Oscar Wilde said, “One must have a heart of stone to read the death of little
*Removes hanky from pocket*
*Sets fire to hanky....*
Praefectus Praetorio
R.I.P. Brother of the Quill
twonines
LIMERICUS
My pleasure!
Praefectus Praetorio
R.I.P. Brother of the Quill
The return of Barbara
Empat Puluh Empat
Outside Raffles Hospital, Downtown Singapore, Monday, post 2:15 PM
Chunhua put Jeffrey in a taxi to home. Then she dialed his house and talked to his wife. She explained that she and Hodges were discussing Barbara’s medical condition when he was informed of the attack on Amanda and that Chunhua had gone to the hospital with him for support. She also explained that he had been given a tranquilizer and should be put to bed as soon as possible. Mrs. Hodges thanked Dr. Liú over and over for her kindness. Chunhua ended the call with a big smile. She hailed a cab for herself to go to Changi. She suspected that Barbara Moore would need her help next.
Call between the Chambers of the Presiding Judge of the State Courts of Singapore and the First Minister of Home Affairs Office New Phoenix Park 2:30 PM
RBG: Hello, my dear Josephine. I presume you have heard of the unfortunate incident with Mr. Hodges assistant?
JS: Yes, Your Ladyship. It is simply terrible! Such a despicable assault!
RBG: Yes, I suppose we must condemn such criminality. However, these things will happen to slutty young girls who shamelessly flaunt their bodies. A lesson for a certain bad girl I know.
JS: (reflexively looking around her office to be sure no-one could hear) Yes, Mama. I am bad.
RBG: We shall have to continue your correction soon, and most firmly. At the moment, I am concerned if there is any way it may affect our “project.”
JS: From that point of view, it is for the best that Lieutenant Rogers passed away. He can not be interrogated and let slip anything of our contact. I can assure you that everything was verbal, and there remains no written record.
RBG” He would not have recorded anything?
JS: No. He was too stupid to think of that. Anyway, I did careful research before first contacting him. He had a reputation for leaving no tracks and for extreme discretion. But how will this affect the appeal hearing tomorrow?
RGB: Not at all, I should think. The Appeal Court might only consider the appropriateness of his “surprise” testimony, not the evidence itself. They are very unlikely to question that given the precedents and guidance. Lieutenant Rogers would not be called to testify.
JS: That is a relief.
RGB: The incident isn’t, of course, anyone's’ fault, except possible the young tramp. These things just happen. However, an unexpected benefit to us is that Mr. Hodges failed to file his brief on time. The court will not make an exception for some loose girl, walking through our sacred Parliament Square, half-naked, who got exactly what she was asking for. Therefore, Hodges can only make oral arguments in a very brief time span. However, tell me, my dear. What do you know about Rogers’s partner, this Jiang? Could he be a problem?
JS: No. He had only been with Rogers for less than a week. My sources say he is rather dull. It seems that he went along with the rape following Rogers’s lead. He will have nothing to give up.
RGB: Very Good. I think we should keep our eye on this Jones slut. Who knows what Rogers might have said to her or what trouble she might try to cause. Have our friends watch her. Any loose ends at the CNB?
JS: I doubt it. Anyway, the CNB is very tight-lipped about their work. They won’t let any information out. Please let me know how it goes in court tomorrow.
RGB: I shall. Though I can assure you there is no possibility of any outcome except the desired.
JS: Excellent! Friday brings the second caning. You gave the Commandant some interesting ideas for enhanced humiliation?
RGB: Oh, yes, my dear! I think it shall be most stimulating. I have to run. Goodbye
JS: Goodbye, Your Ladyship.
Raffles Hospital, Downtown Singapore, 2:40 PM
After Hodges and Liú left, Frost turned to Musa.
“I never got lunch today, and we’ll have to wait until six or seven to interview the girl—you up for going to grab a bite and a bit of bitter in the meantime.
“That is a fine idea,” said the Guards’ Inspector. I know the owner of a quiet little bar around the corner, where we can get some excellent food and speak privately in his side room.”
“Sounds Blinding!” said Frost.
Cell, Death Row, Changi Prison, Monday 3:00 PM
Barbara was curled up on her mat, shackled, and leashed to the wall when the guards arrived. Lim Hua-Upp and two others.
“Hurry, you dirty bitch. The Commandant wants to see you at once!”
He took her leash and led her out of the cell and down the hall, shuffling on all fours.
When they thought she was too slow, one of the trailing guards would hit her sore butt lightly with his truncheon.
The Adjournment Pub, Off Parliament Square, Monday 3:10 PM
The pub that Musa had suggested, “The Adjournment,” was just off Parliament Square. Frost thought it an attempt, and not a bad one to replicate a traditional English pub. The owner, who was Pakistani, greeted Musa warmly and showed them to a small, semi-private room toward the back.
Frost ordered a pint of bitter (as claimed to be authentic by the owner), and Musa asked for a bottle of IPA. Frost lifted an eyebrow.
“I thought Muslins didn’t drink alcohol.”
“They don’t,” smiled Musa. “Though, some do. And, besides, I’m Malay but Christian. My family converted two generations ago.”
They ordered and engaged in small talk until their food (Frost had ‘fish and chips,” and Musa ordered a version of Katong laksa, cut-up noodles in spicy coconut curry soup with shrimp, fish cakes, egg and chicken meat. Musa requested “extra spicy”) arrived.
Frost was surprised that the ale provided was almost mistakable for real bitter and the fish and chips a passable imitation of the ones he’d grown up loving in the West Country.
As they were winding down the meal, Jack spoke up. “Look, darling, I’ve got to get something off my chest. All that promising, hand-on-heart stuff? - are you serious about following this investigation wherever it may lead?”
Empat Puluh Empat
Outside Raffles Hospital, Downtown Singapore, Monday, post 2:15 PM
Chunhua put Jeffrey in a taxi to home. Then she dialed his house and talked to his wife. She explained that she and Hodges were discussing Barbara’s medical condition when he was informed of the attack on Amanda and that Chunhua had gone to the hospital with him for support. She also explained that he had been given a tranquilizer and should be put to bed as soon as possible. Mrs. Hodges thanked Dr. Liú over and over for her kindness. Chunhua ended the call with a big smile. She hailed a cab for herself to go to Changi. She suspected that Barbara Moore would need her help next.
Call between the Chambers of the Presiding Judge of the State Courts of Singapore and the First Minister of Home Affairs Office New Phoenix Park 2:30 PM
RBG: Hello, my dear Josephine. I presume you have heard of the unfortunate incident with Mr. Hodges assistant?
JS: Yes, Your Ladyship. It is simply terrible! Such a despicable assault!
RBG: Yes, I suppose we must condemn such criminality. However, these things will happen to slutty young girls who shamelessly flaunt their bodies. A lesson for a certain bad girl I know.
JS: (reflexively looking around her office to be sure no-one could hear) Yes, Mama. I am bad.
RBG: We shall have to continue your correction soon, and most firmly. At the moment, I am concerned if there is any way it may affect our “project.”
JS: From that point of view, it is for the best that Lieutenant Rogers passed away. He can not be interrogated and let slip anything of our contact. I can assure you that everything was verbal, and there remains no written record.
RBG” He would not have recorded anything?
JS: No. He was too stupid to think of that. Anyway, I did careful research before first contacting him. He had a reputation for leaving no tracks and for extreme discretion. But how will this affect the appeal hearing tomorrow?
RGB: Not at all, I should think. The Appeal Court might only consider the appropriateness of his “surprise” testimony, not the evidence itself. They are very unlikely to question that given the precedents and guidance. Lieutenant Rogers would not be called to testify.
JS: That is a relief.
RGB: The incident isn’t, of course, anyone's’ fault, except possible the young tramp. These things just happen. However, an unexpected benefit to us is that Mr. Hodges failed to file his brief on time. The court will not make an exception for some loose girl, walking through our sacred Parliament Square, half-naked, who got exactly what she was asking for. Therefore, Hodges can only make oral arguments in a very brief time span. However, tell me, my dear. What do you know about Rogers’s partner, this Jiang? Could he be a problem?
JS: No. He had only been with Rogers for less than a week. My sources say he is rather dull. It seems that he went along with the rape following Rogers’s lead. He will have nothing to give up.
RGB: Very Good. I think we should keep our eye on this Jones slut. Who knows what Rogers might have said to her or what trouble she might try to cause. Have our friends watch her. Any loose ends at the CNB?
JS: I doubt it. Anyway, the CNB is very tight-lipped about their work. They won’t let any information out. Please let me know how it goes in court tomorrow.
RGB: I shall. Though I can assure you there is no possibility of any outcome except the desired.
JS: Excellent! Friday brings the second caning. You gave the Commandant some interesting ideas for enhanced humiliation?
RGB: Oh, yes, my dear! I think it shall be most stimulating. I have to run. Goodbye
JS: Goodbye, Your Ladyship.
Raffles Hospital, Downtown Singapore, 2:40 PM
After Hodges and Liú left, Frost turned to Musa.
“I never got lunch today, and we’ll have to wait until six or seven to interview the girl—you up for going to grab a bite and a bit of bitter in the meantime.
“That is a fine idea,” said the Guards’ Inspector. I know the owner of a quiet little bar around the corner, where we can get some excellent food and speak privately in his side room.”
“Sounds Blinding!” said Frost.
Cell, Death Row, Changi Prison, Monday 3:00 PM
Barbara was curled up on her mat, shackled, and leashed to the wall when the guards arrived. Lim Hua-Upp and two others.
“Hurry, you dirty bitch. The Commandant wants to see you at once!”
He took her leash and led her out of the cell and down the hall, shuffling on all fours.
When they thought she was too slow, one of the trailing guards would hit her sore butt lightly with his truncheon.
The Adjournment Pub, Off Parliament Square, Monday 3:10 PM
The pub that Musa had suggested, “The Adjournment,” was just off Parliament Square. Frost thought it an attempt, and not a bad one to replicate a traditional English pub. The owner, who was Pakistani, greeted Musa warmly and showed them to a small, semi-private room toward the back.
Frost ordered a pint of bitter (as claimed to be authentic by the owner), and Musa asked for a bottle of IPA. Frost lifted an eyebrow.
“I thought Muslins didn’t drink alcohol.”
“They don’t,” smiled Musa. “Though, some do. And, besides, I’m Malay but Christian. My family converted two generations ago.”
They ordered and engaged in small talk until their food (Frost had ‘fish and chips,” and Musa ordered a version of Katong laksa, cut-up noodles in spicy coconut curry soup with shrimp, fish cakes, egg and chicken meat. Musa requested “extra spicy”) arrived.
Frost was surprised that the ale provided was almost mistakable for real bitter and the fish and chips a passable imitation of the ones he’d grown up loving in the West Country.
As they were winding down the meal, Jack spoke up. “Look, darling, I’ve got to get something off my chest. All that promising, hand-on-heart stuff? - are you serious about following this investigation wherever it may lead?”
Fossy
SEXPIOGENTUS
Looks like the eleventh hour has almost come and gone for Barb ... Will there be a last minute reprieve? JS and RGB could yet become the true Nemesis for poor Amanda. Their sympathy for her 'situation' is thin to say the least ...
Cant wait for the next episode!