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Raising the Cross - Which Way?

Which method of Crucifixion arouses the sense more?


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Difficult to answer, both is very arousing, and the raising is one of the most awesome scenes of a crucifixion. But imagine what might happen after the nailing of the wrists when only the patibulum will be moved upwards. The arms are no longer fixed by ropes, they were removed by sharp knives which had also cut in the flesh of the upper arms; ropes are no longer needed, because the victim shall only be fixed by wrist nails.

Almost every victim cries and writhes the body while nails are driven in the wrists. The executioners (3 are needed, and I am one of them!) wait a few minutes until the victim has calmed down a little, then my 2 helping guards grab the patibulum at the left and right side, the victim starts crying and writhing again, while I am fixing the rope for the raise process in the middle of the patibulum behind the head of the victim: first hammering a big ring in the wood (remember the excruciating pain in the nail wounds, caused by vibrations!), afterwards I fasten the rope wirth knots in this ring. When I have finished, the helpers simply let fall the patibulum to the ground, now the victim screams and writhes for several minutes. When he (or she) calms down again, we start the rising and the rope is tautened by a pulley block behind the stipes. First the patibulum is only drawn near the stipes, and the crying victim will push with the feet to slide with the naked back over the rough ground, but now the shoulder blades lift and the victim first sustains with the back of the head and curves the neck, later we watch all muscles of the upper part of the body trembling, but also writhing in pain. More and more weight is taken by the nails. Now the nailed person is sitting on his bare buttocks, and when lifted furthermore, all victims are wreathing to genuflecting position on their knees which are already bleeding from often falling down on their via crucis (because they cannot use their arms, they fall on their knees each time!) And now a further lifting, and the wrist nailed person is crying blue murder and is writhing and skewing his body when trying to stand on the feet. The patibulum, which is only fixed in the middle, staggers around, and when the knees buckle, a terrible feeling of jerking which causes more screeches and writhing. And finally standing on the feet or a bit later on tip toes: an excellent position to flagellate the bare chest presented with the outstretched arms. Or several kicks to hollow of the knee and shin. What about fucking the asshole with a rough wooden stake and raping the bitches with this stake? A hard ball busting for the male victims? Removing a little bit of flesh from the armpits with pincers? And afterwards hanging only by the wrist nails and screaming and writhing when raised up furthermore and trying desperately to take some weight away from the arms by using legs and feet to support, pressing them against the rough wood of the stipes, sliding down again and reopening the wounds of the flagellation. When reaching the top of the stipes, the patibulum will be hiked up about 30 cms over the top, the rope will be cut with a knife and the patibulum plumps down on the pin. The whole rising process can be prolonged to a 1-hour-torture, very arousing for all, and now imagine the movements and yaup when the foot bones are shattered by nails, and each rearing means an augmentation of excruciating pain in the nail wounds and causes further writhing!

The best part of all crucifixions will start now: the cross dance! But this is another theme. Only remember the excruciating pain caused even by light movements, and each victim will react in a different way... But all of them will show their own "agony-performance" which can be watched for hours, sometimes even one day and night ordeal-enjoyment!
 
I'm not so sure they were raised at all

I think thats a product of christian inspired art

I've no doubt that most crucifixions were carried out by binding the arms above the head to an existing tree trunk while the victim was stood on the ground or at most a small temporary platform.

Then the feet or ankles were bound to the sides or front of the trunk.

Then in full view of the crowd the terrified victim, already aware of the impossible stress position they will die in, was nailedn o doubt with some theatre and taunting.

I imagine they took their time and no small amount of interaction with the crowd. I imagine some executioners were celebrities who put on a good show.

If there was a cross beam I believe the victim was bound to it before setting off to their death. They had no choice but to carry it as they were whipped or dragged through the streets to the waiting tree trunk.

Once at the torture stake theyd be nailed and then one man at each end of the crossbeam, histed a few inches up onto an awaiting support, secured with a few turns of rope then onto the feet or ankles as before.

I think it was intimate, close up and personal. The christian imagery is just an attempt to inject some fictional grandeur into an exhibition of humiliation and sexual torture.
 
I'm not so sure they were raised at all

I think thats a product of christian inspired art

I've no doubt that most crucifixions were carried out by binding the arms above the head to an existing tree trunk while the victim was stood on the ground or at most a small temporary platform.

Then the feet or ankles were bound to the sides or front of the trunk.

Then in full view of the crowd the terrified victim, already aware of the impossible stress position they will die in, was nailedn o doubt with some theatre and taunting.

I imagine they took their time and no small amount of interaction with the crowd. I imagine some executioners were celebrities who put on a good show.

If there was a cross beam I believe the victim was bound to it before setting off to their death. They had no choice but to carry it as they were whipped or dragged through the streets to the waiting tree trunk.

Once at the torture stake theyd be nailed and then one man at each end of the crossbeam, histed a few inches up onto an awaiting support, secured with a few turns of rope then onto the feet or ankles as before.

I think it was intimate, close up and personal. The christian imagery is just an attempt to inject some fictional grandeur into an exhibition of humiliation and sexual torture.

Early Christian imagery only shows the upright cross, it is really in much later centuries that we see the depiction of nailing and raising. Perhaps this is because it is damned dramatic, and appealed very much to later artists. The early iconography, in the Dream of the Rood for example, has all the grandeur you need, it depicts a more heroic, warrior like Christ as befits a warrior people, who is not raised but climbs onto the cross.

Then the young hero (who was God almighty)
Got ready, resolute and strong in heart.
He climbed onto the lofty gallows-tree, 45
Bold in the sight of many watching men,
When he intended to redeem mankind.
I trembled as the warrior embraced me.

As the centuries get closer to our own time we find a greater emphasis on the torture and suffering. Make of that what you will.

Tree, stake or carefully crafted cross, they all have something to offer
 
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Think these show the best method. Make the condemned carry the patibulum and just steer them. A wooden beam and nails through the wrists make an excellent steering mechanism. Also notice in both that the legs/ ankles are hobbled, not bound. No kicking. Also the guy on the right is staying outside the kick zone.
 
View attachment 842855View attachment 842854

Think these show the best method. Make the condemned carry the patibulum and just steer them. A wooden beam and nails through the wrists make an excellent steering mechanism. Also notice in both that the legs/ ankles are hobbled, not bound. No kicking. Also the guy on the right is staying outside the kick zone.
Exactly. That would be a permanent set up. A more improvised affair could use a tree to hang the cross bar on, victim already at least tied to it, maybe nailed. Easy to find a Y shaped tree with branches you can hoof a beam onto.

I think raising a ready made cross would be a rare, over complicated and difficult affair.
 
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Something i love about this set up is that there wouldnt be any kicking. They would enthusiastically co operate with any efforts to secure the feet to the beam. Any relief from the weight on the wrist nails would be welcome.... even though they know worse is to come...
 
We rebels can be a rather contrary and troublesome lot when we want to be ... ;)
Crossgirl Hiliary said:
"Where's a whip

whip006.png
There is a way.
The Lord of The Whip says "NAY!...NAY!...NAY!"
And IF You lag; He will say...
"Where there's a Whip...THERE IS A WAY!"
(From animated "The Lord of The Ring" by Bashki.
 
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Crossgirl Hiliary said:
"Where's a whip

View attachment 1031833
There is a way.
The Lord of The Whip says "NAY!...NAY!...NAY!"
And IF You lag; He will say...
"Where there's a Whip...THERE IS A WAY!"
(From animated "The Lord of The Ring" by Bashki.
I remember that. Generally I don't like musical adaptations, but the "Where there's a whip" song was fun.
 
Crossgirl Hiliary said:
"Where's a whip

View attachment 1031833
There is a way.
The Lord of The Whip says "NAY!...NAY!...NAY!"
And IF You lag; He will say...
"Where there's a Whip...THERE IS A WAY!"
(From animated "The Lord of The Ring" by Bashki.
Click to expand...
I remember that. Generally I don't like musical adaptations, but the "Where there's a whip" song was fun.

Cruxgirl Hiliary said:
I agree...
 
[IMG alt="woodflesh"]https://www.cruxforums.com/xf/data/avatars/m/18/18359.jpg?1433512028[/IMG]

woodflesh

Executioner​

Woodflesh said:
Raising

What do you prefer to see?

The whole cross raising together with the victim hanging by nails

or

the patibulum is lifted to the top of the already vertically standing stipes together with the victim hanging by wrist nails

Let me know the reason of your decision.

Cruxgirl Hiliary
Either way will do. As a victim I have no choice in how I am to die.
I prefer the first option. I think this saves victim more energy when the crucifixion is complete. I also like when the cross drops for women because of the bouncing of the breasts. A perfect example can be found in Marcus' stories such as Lisa Marie and Three Young Models.
 
I prefer the first option. I think this saves victim more energy when the crucifixion is complete. I also like when the cross drops for women because of the bouncing of the breasts. A perfect example can be found in Marcus' stories such as Lisa Marie and Three Young Models.
Yeah, hehehehehehehehe, our boobs do bounce and there is NOT a damn thing we can do about it, hehehehehehehehe, especially in a situation like that, arms spread wide, no bra, and a drop of maybe a foot, there is no doubt, going to be bouncing, heheheheheheheeheh
 
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I prefer the first option. I think this saves victim more energy when the crucifixion is complete. I also like when the cross drops for women because of the bouncing of the breasts. A perfect example can be found in Marcus' stories such as Lisa Marie and Three Young Models.
For women, boobs but also for men it is nice to see the penis bounce !!!
 
From an aesthetic point of view - I would prefer the 2nd option.

But I believe that is was much more useful to nail both wrists and feet while the cross is laying on the ground. Executioner doesn‘t need to work against gravitation , and can finalize the procedure in a position which is comfortable for him.

When the cross is raised, I think the feet of the victim are in height of the executioner‘s knees or hips, so he has to knuckle down to do the work, which is much more uncomfortable.

Ten crosses in the morning, and your back will hurt as hell!

Am I wrong?
 

Crucifixion Practicalities​

Hi there,

I have it in mind to produce a comic book story featuring a crucifixion within the Roman empire. I want to make it as realistic as I can, but there are certain practical details that I'm struggling with. I figure you guys are just the people to enlighten me...

So, I gather that despite all that "stations of the cross" stuff we see in church, what the victim actually had to carry was just the crossbar to the cross - the upright part was waiting for them at the place of execution. Ok, that makes sense, but here's where the confusion starts...

Most of the sources I've read, for example this one: https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/controversy/common-misconceptions/the-facts-of-crucifixion.html say that the victim would then be tied/nailed to the crossbar, and then "raised and placed on the upright post." But how would that "raising" actually take place? Some kind of hoist apparatus? Stools either side that soldiers stand on and lift the condemned? And once the raising is done, how is the crossbar attached to the upright without the condemned getting in the way?

In my mind's eye, it all seems very difficult. What seems a lot easier to me is to make a socket in the ground into which the upright can be inserted. The upright is laid on the ground, and the crossbeam attached (nailed?) to it, a sign attached to the top, and finally the condemned is tied/nailed to it top and bottom. All this is easy to do at ground level. Then the whole assemblage is lifted and inserted into the socket. Once they're dead - however many hours/days later - the process can be reversed.

That's how I would do it, but how did the Romans do it?
 
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Crucifixion Practicalities​

Hi there,

I have it in mind to produce a comic book story featuring a crucifixion within the Roman empire. I want to make it as realistic as I can, but there are certain practical details that I'm struggling with. I figure you guys are just the people to enlighten me...

So, I gather that despite all that "stations of the cross" stuff we see in church, what the victim actually had to carry was just the crossbar to the cross - the upright part was waiting for them at the place of execution. Ok, that makes sense, but here's where the confusion starts...

Most of the sources I've read, for example this one: https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/controversy/common-misconceptions/the-facts-of-crucifixion.html say that the victim would then be tied/nailed to the crossbar, and then "raised and placed on the upright post." But how would that "raising" actually take place? Some kind of hoist apparatus? Stools either side that soldiers stand on and lift the condemned? And once the raising is done, how is the crossbar attached to the upright without the condemned getting in the way?

In my mind's eye, it all seems very difficult. What seems a lot easier to me is to make a socket in the ground into which the upright can be inserted. The upright is laid on the ground, and the crossbeam attached (nailed?) to it, a sign attached to the top, and finally the condemned is tied/nailed to it top and bottom. All this is easy to do at ground level. Then the whole assemblage is lifted and inserted into the socket. Once they're dead - however many hours/days later - the process can be reversed.

That's how I would do it, but how did the Romans do it?
I move your posting on this place. Maybe you find answers here or more doubts?
 
A few ideas for when the cross doesn't have to be that high
@moebius


73dffec8764357ff949e42f669fa985d_original2.pngcxy022.JPGcsK010.gif liftingFSSK.jpg
 
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