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Were females breast flogged to ribbons before crucifixion?

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AlexArts

Soul of Cinder
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#62
Well, everyone has their vices Alex.

Whipping breasts to shreads just seems needlessly extra. She’s already whipped and crucified. She’ll suffer just fine, anything else done to the condemned is merely to sate the bloodlust (or regular lust) of the executioner.
I'm talking about breasts tortures. During interrogation, for example. It's the offtop but i'm interested
 

AlexArts

Soul of Cinder
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#64
Are you asking if they were done in real life? The writers and artists here on CF have described them many times. Surely they wouldn't just make stuff up, would they?:rolleyes::doh:
I want to know how it was in real life...
Do all this things were applied to women's breasts. All this rippers, mashers and other things.
Darkmind's (or other writers) fantasies couldn't inspired me ever.
 

mp5stab

COMIX CARNIFIXA
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#65
I want to know how it was in real life...
Do all this things were applied to women's breasts. All this rippers, mashers and other things.
Darkmind's (or other writers) fantasies couldn't inspired me ever.
If someone can imagine it, someone can attempt it for real. Anything to extract a confession.
 

Xirix7

Assistant executioner
Joined
Jul 5, 2018
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#67
Anything (if you are talking about breasts tortures) could be too dangerous. There is a big risk to be left without any confessions
But if she is about to be crucified, a woman having her breasts torn up would't matter to the overall all torture and destruction to her body.

This would be far more for those watching her to enjoy her during her end.

You have to imagine her loss to her during such a quarter hour. Fucking awesome.
 

AlexArts

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#70
I think such things were all part of the medieval torturer’s tool kit. Hard to imagine they weren’t ever used :confused:
Like i said earlier, there was (or were) an ancient tutorial for the executioners. "You should pay an attention to women's breasts, there are a lot of veins in it" - quote from this tutorial.
There is a nasty site torturesru.com, there i found this quote...

But i think any manipulations with women's breasts were performed only for her additional humiliation...
 
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#71
Like i said earlier, there was (or were) an ancient tutorial for the executioners. "You should pay an attention to women's breasts, there are a lot of veins in it" - quote from this tutorial.
There is a nasty site torturesru.com, there i found this quote...

But i think any manipulations with women's breasts were performed only for her additional humiliation...
Um no, Nobody has ever found a "how to text" on torture that goes back to ancient times. That's not really a good question and you shouldn't take the internet (ESPECIALLY the Russian internet) at face value.

A good deal of what we "know" about ancient torture is based on actual passages in other texts and surviving instruments (if you are interested I would recommend either Mark P. Donnelly's "The Big Book of Pain" or Brian Innes "The History of Torture". Both books point out that torture is NOT a reliable method for obtaining accurate information. And both books point out that there is probably a great deal of embellishment in ancient and medieval texts.) The concept of written 'history' as 'facts' is relatively new concept in human civilization.

However, a woman's breasts, because of their structure, does bruise incredibly easily. That's one reason women fencers wear a armored plastron and male fencers don't.

And since it has an eroginist zone it is also very sensitive. It obviously didn't take humans too long to figure out that you cause the most pain in sensitive areas (Why do you think every woman's defense class teaches us to go after your balls?).

So I suspect that there was no one 'this is how you do it' and torturers learned their trade the way most people back then did (by apprenticeship) and then experimented depending on their personal preferences.

As an example, rape is commonly used today as a form of humiliation and torture. And it wasn't thought up yesterday.

Basically if you can think of a way to inflict pain on a woman, short of modern things like electricity, someone else had done it centuries before you were born.

kisses

willowfall
 

thehangingtree

Proconsul
Staff member
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Near the coffee shop, Pacific, Mo
#72
Um no, Nobody has ever found a "how to text" on torture that goes back to ancient times. That's not really a good question and you shouldn't take the internet (ESPECIALLY the Russian internet) at face value.

A good deal of what we "know" about ancient torture is based on actual passages in other texts and surviving instruments (if you are interested I would recommend either Mark P. Donnelly's "The Big Book of Pain" or Brian Innes "The History of Torture". Both books point out that torture is NOT a reliable method for obtaining accurate information. And both books point out that there is probably a great deal of embellishment in ancient and medieval texts.) The concept of written 'history' as 'facts' is relatively new concept in human civilization.

However, a woman's breasts, because of their structure, does bruise incredibly easily. That's one reason women fencers wear a armored plastron and male fencers don't.

And since it has an eroginist zone it is also very sensitive. It obviously didn't take humans too long to figure out that you cause the most pain in sensitive areas (Why do you think every woman's defense class teaches us to go after your balls?).

So I suspect that there was no one 'this is how you do it' and torturers learned their trade the way most people back then did (by apprenticeship) and then experimented depending on their personal preferences.

As an example, rape is commonly used today as a form of humiliation and torture. And it wasn't thought up yesterday.

Basically if you can think of a way to inflict pain on a woman, short of modern things like electricity, someone else had done it centuries before you were born.

kisses

willowfall
Are you sure???
 
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#73
Fairly sure. Both authors are pretty good at their research if a known torture manual did exist from say Rome they would have found it or at least found references too it.

NOW there is the issue of the Library in Alexandria and what it actually contained before it was damaged by Christian fanatics and then finally destroyed by Islamic conquerors. We don't know everything that was in there.

However, we do know of the existence of a lot of books because they are referenced by other authors. So there are Byzantine writers who reference older history and military treatises and quote passages from those books.

But the books themselves are gone (or undiscovered, ex: the Dead Sea Scrolls).

There is a lot of 'false' history floating around based on propaganda. For example, if you review the Spanish Inquisition archive in Seville (yes they still exist) you will see they didn't consider "witchcraft" a crime but considered belief in witches an insanity. People were not condemned to the stake for "witchcraft" in Seville.

However in Protestant Reformation Europe, belief in "witchcraft" was very strong and they constantly burned people for practicing the dark arts. The last women brunt at the stake (not for witchcraft) in Great Britain was burnt in, I think, 1782(?).

No Iron Maiden has ever been found south of the Pyrenees.

Yet because of Hollywood (in a country where the establishment is WASP) people in the US associate both burning witches and the IM with the CATHOLIC inquisition. Conveniently forgetting that the only witch trials in the US were conducted by Protestant fundamentalists.

So will I swear on a stack of bibles that one NEVER existed, no. But until you can show me otherwise, I'll bet a load of money on it didn't.

There is one more thing to factor in, literacy was uncommon until the Enlightenment and even then didn't really get to the masses until the late 18th Century. Books even more so, many a rich person prided themselves on actually owning a few books. What would be the purpose of writing a torture manual for such a limited audience who I'd bet publically (like the Victorians and kinky sex) thought such information was beneath them as the 'elite' of their societies.

After all, even later Roman writers pilloried Caligula for his 'perverted' interests. One of which seems to be inflicting pain. So why would a learned person, part of the intelligentsia, stoop to writing about something so base and abhorrent as "torture" unless it was to make a larger point?

kisses

willowfall
 

thehangingtree

Proconsul
Staff member
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#74
Fairly sure. Both authors are pretty good at their research if a known torture manual did exist from say Rome they would have found it or at least found references too it.

NOW there is the issue of the Library in Alexandria and what it actually contained before it was damaged by Christian fanatics and then finally destroyed by Islamic conquerors. We don't know everything that was in there.

However, we do know of the existence of a lot of books because they are referenced by other authors. So there are Byzantine writers who reference older history and military treatises and quote passages from those books.

But the books themselves are gone (or undiscovered, ex: the Dead Sea Scrolls).

There is a lot of 'false' history floating around based on propaganda. For example, if you review the Spanish Inquisition archive in Seville (yes they still exist) you will see they didn't consider "witchcraft" a crime but considered belief in witches an insanity. People were not condemned to the stake for "witchcraft" in Seville.

However in Protestant Reformation Europe, belief in "witchcraft" was very strong and they constantly burned people for practicing the dark arts. The last women brunt at the stake (not for witchcraft) in Great Britain was burnt in, I think, 1782(?).

No Iron Maiden has ever been found south of the Pyrenees.

Yet because of Hollywood (in a country where the establishment is WASP) people in the US associate both burning witches and the IM with the CATHOLIC inquisition. Conveniently forgetting that the only witch trials in the US were conducted by Protestant fundamentalists.

So will I swear on a stack of bibles that one NEVER existed, no. But until you can show me otherwise, I'll bet a load of money on it didn't.

There is one more thing to factor in, literacy was uncommon until the Enlightenment and even then didn't really get to the masses until the late 18th Century. Books even more so, many a rich person prided themselves on actually owning a few books. What would be the purpose of writing a torture manual for such a limited audience who I'd bet publically (like the Victorians and kinky sex) thought such information was beneath them as the 'elite' of their societies.

After all, even later Roman writers pilloried Caligula for his 'perverted' interests. One of which seems to be inflicting pain. So why would a learned person, part of the intelligentsia, stoop to writing about something so base and abhorrent as "torture" unless it was to make a larger point?

kisses

willowfall
Tree still doesn't understand the point of this. Why beat someone you are executing? I will drink...
 

AlexArts

Soul of Cinder
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#76
ESPECIALLY the Russian internet
I found two different sources on my language...
First source, most respectable, is "Courts against witchcrafting" by Nikolay Bessonov. You could see his artworks here. And he is left us...
So, in the chapter 11 you can find a description of the last women's path to the fire. He described that women's breasts were torn by red-hot pincers.
example01.jpg
You can see it on picture above... Horrific!
Another picture
example02.jpg

Second source
The book by Alexei Chapygin "Stepan Razin"
On Russian... Hard to translate

"Ефим отвел Ириньицу от Разина, толкнул в пытошную.
— Поставь огонь! Подержи ей руки, чтоб змеенышей не питала на государеву-цареву голову…
Ириньица худо помнила, что делали с ней. Дьяк поставил факел на стену, скинул кафтан, повернулся к ней спиной, руками крепко схватил за руки, придвинулся к огню — она почти висела на широкой спине дьяка.
— А-а-а-й! — закричала она безумным голосом, перед глазами брызнуло молоко и зашипело на каленых щипцах.
— О-о-ой! Ба-а… — Снова брызнуло молоко, и вторая грудь, выщипнутая каленым железом, упала на пол.
— Утопнешь в крови, сатана! — загремел голос в пустом отделении башни."

Another horrific description of punishment...
 
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#77
"Yefim took Orinico from Razin, pushed in Petoskey.
Put the fire! Hold her hands, so that the snakes do not feed on the sovereign-the Tsar's head…
Iranica ill remember what he did to her. The clerik placed the torch on the wall, took off the kaftan, turned his back to her, hands clutched in hand, moved closer to the fire she was almost hanging on the broad back of a clerik.
- Aaai! She cried in a mad voice, and the milk splashed before her eyes and hissed on the hot tongs.
— Oh-Oh-Oh! BA-Ah — - again sprayed milk, and the second breast, plucked with a hot iron, fell to the floor.
— Drown in the blood, Satan! a voice boomed in the empty compartment of the tower."

It's a simplified translation. The "Дьяк" is not translated exactly as the clerik. It is an old Russian word meaning both a priest and a civil servant. "кафтан" is an old Russian men's outerwear.
 

AlexArts

Soul of Cinder
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#78