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Rupert_137

Assistant executioner
I don't think we'll see a crucifixion because this type of execution was abolished in AD 313 by Emperor Constantine in the Roman Empire out of respect for Christianity ... I think PP has incorporated so many historical references into his story that he will take this into account - right?
 

Praefectus Praetorio

Brother of the Quill
I don't think we'll see a crucifixion because this type of execution was abolished in AD 313 by Emperor Constantine in the Roman Empire out of respect for Christianity ... I think PP has incorporated so many historical references into his story that he will take this into account - right?
Rupert. I'm so glad to have someone take an interest in the details of Roman law, customs, (and gastronomy?) of the time.
The legal standing (pun intended) of crucifixio after the ascension of Constantine is not completely clear. The story of Constantine, before the Battle of the Milvian Bridge in 312, seeing a cross in the sky and hearing the words, "In Hoc Signo Vinces" (In this sign you will conquer - the source of the still standard Christian symbol, IHS) and soon after banning crucifixio in honor of Christ, was given in a book published in 361 by Roman historian Sextus Aurelius Victor. There is no record of a legal action of this kind. We know Constantine played an influential role in the proclamation of the Edict of Milan in 313, which declared tolerance for Christianity in the Roman Empire a year after his victory. His mother certainly was a devout Christian. However, the Emperor, himself was only baptized on his deathbed in 337, twenty-six years after his supposed revelation.
As a counter-argument to the reported ban, there is the testimony of Iulius Firmicus Maternus V C. About the year 346, he composed De errore profanarum religionum (On the error of profane religions), which he dedicated to Constantius II and Constans, the sons of Constantine, who was probably still alive. In this work, he claimed that crucifixion was still a lawful punishment at least two decades after Constantine’s alleged proscription. Our oldest unambiguous record of a crucifixion ban is the Codex Theodosianus (Code of Theodosius), published in 438 more than a century after Constantine died. and fifty-five years after our story. It is my opinion that any ban (if it existed) was sporadically enforced and not particularly binding in Gallia Narbonensis in 383.
Sorry Barbara!

However, an interesting textual coincidence is raised by this discussion. One of the two text sources for the Codex Theodosianus is found in the Breviary of Alaric (also called Lex Romana Visigothorum), promulgated on 2 February 506. Therefore, our earliest source for the end of state-sponsored crucifixio is a document codifying Roman Law in the Visigothic kingdom of Barbara's Gothic tribes that succeeded the Western Roman Empire.

One wonders if I planned that ahead?
 

Praefectus Praetorio

Brother of the Quill
I don't think we'll see a crucifixion because this type of execution was abolished in AD 313 by Emperor Constantine in the Roman Empire out of respect for Christianity ... I think PP has incorporated so many historical references into his story that he will take this into account - right?
Surely, we’re not going to let mere facts get in the way of a good story? :eek: :confused:
Nah, sounds completely as lobbed with a quick google search and oure coincidence to me?

Bravo, again well played! Thank you. I no longer care which fate Barb faces, I’m wrapped up in your version of it now
I can promise there will be a few unexpected twists and turns ahead. In fact, if my aging memory serves me right, there will be an interesting new development tomorrow.
 

Rupert_137

Assistant executioner
Rupert. I'm so glad to have someone take an interest in the details of Roman law, customs, (and gastronomy?) of the time.
The legal standing (pun intended) of crucifixio after the ascension of Constantine is not completely clear. The story of Constantine, before the Battle of the Milvian Bridge in 312, seeing a cross in the sky and hearing the words, "In Hoc Signo Vinces" (In this sign you will conquer - the source of the still standard Christian symbol, IHS) and soon after banning crucifixio in honor of Christ, was given in a book published in 361 by Roman historian Sextus Aurelius Victor. There is no record of a legal action of this kind. We know Constantine played an influential role in the proclamation of the Edict of Milan in 313, which declared tolerance for Christianity in the Roman Empire a year after his victory. His mother certainly was a devout Christian. However, the Emperor, himself was only baptized on his deathbed in 337, twenty-six years after his supposed revelation.
As a counter-argument to the reported ban, there is the testimony of Iulius Firmicus Maternus V C. About the year 346, he composed De errore profanarum religionum (On the error of profane religions), which he dedicated to Constantius II and Constans, the sons of Constantine, who was probably still alive. In this work, he claimed that crucifixion was still a lawful punishment at least two decades after Constantine’s alleged proscription. Our oldest unambiguous record of a crucifixion ban is the Codex Theodosianus (Code of Theodosius), published in 438 more than a century after Constantine died. and fifty-five years after our story. It is my opinion that any ban (if it existed) was sporadically enforced and not particularly binding in Gallia Narbonensis in 383.
Sorry Barbara!

However, an interesting textual coincidence is raised by this discussion. One of the two text sources for the Codex Theodosianus is found in the Breviary of Alaric (also called Lex Romana Visigothorum), promulgated on 2 February 506. Therefore, our earliest source for the end of state-sponsored crucifixio is a document codifying Roman Law in the Visigothic kingdom of Barbara's Gothic tribes that succeeded the Western Roman Empire.

One wonders if I planned that ahead?
Thank you for the extensive and detailed feedback, Praefectus Praetorio!
I did not want to disturb the course of your well written story at all, which is why I held back my point for a long time. You built up the tension over the final punishment of your sad heroine very well and, as I noticed, made many of your readers cheer...
I think, however, that the Crux Forum should at least know that there were generally no more crucifixions in the 4th century in the Roman Empire (since Emperor Constantine). But of course not every fantasy story has to adhere to it.
I'm expecting your interesting new development tomorrow... And thank you very much for this story!
 

Rupert_137

Assistant executioner
Nah, sounds completely as lobbed with a quick google search and oure coincidence to me?

Bravo, again well played! Thank you. I no longer care which fate Barb faces, I’m wrapped up in your version of it now
It's, as is so often the case in our day... Of course, I knew Emperor Constantine abolished crucifixions, but I quickly googled the year ... you always need to know what you're looking for!
See more in my answer for the author above...
 

Praefectus Praetorio

Brother of the Quill
Barbara's areolas had puckered with the overnight cool of the convivium, causing the nipples to point tumescently. Now, that cool inside air gave way to the powerful morning rays of the summer sun as Barbara emerged almost naked with her escort into the atrium. The bright sun blinded her for a moment, and she raised her unfettered arms to shield her eyes. The unconsciously sensuous gesture bared her whole front to the lustful audience. Her fair skin, pink and glistening from the recent scrubbing, was only moderately marred by the remaining marks of the previous day's ordeal. From her long straight black hair framing her sweet face, to her full, raised breasts and flat tummy, down to her flared hips, partially covered pussy, and long, shapely thighs and legs, the girl’s body was a stunningly erotic sight.
The crowd of men caught its breath at the enchanting sight. But, today, they did not focus their passion on loving or even the brutal sex of yesterday. No, today, they were anticipating how her body would jump and twist and bleed in the throes of a terrible, cutting assault!

With her eyes now adjusted, Barbara was surprised at the size of the crowd – thirty or forty soldiers, a half dozen men in togas, and another dozen servants – all gathered around under the surrounding porticos – all staring at her with cruel lust.
There was no real resistance left in the beaten girl, but she did stop to look around at this multitude of tormentors. One of the soldiers behind her swung a length of leather into her butt to urge her forward. “Move, meretrix (Move it slut),” he said, urging her toward the center. The girl looked up in terror at the iujum looming above her. She prayed they wouldn’t tie her arms there again - her shoulders still ached from that strain. She sighed with relief when the men steered her past the uprights. Then she saw it in front of her! A thick stake, anchored securely in the ground. The blunt thing was over a passum (five feet) tall and three pedes (feet) in circumference. From the top of the pole, several chains hung. Several more were bolted to the base. The wood, though rough-hewn, looked as if it had been smoothed by much wear. Much of the wood was stained a darker reddish-brown.
This post had been a dreaded fixture in the center of the castra for over a century. Even as soldiers walked by it on their everyday routine, many would shiver at the thought of what this heavy wood post represented. Countless wayward soldiers had been bound here and had their backs flayed. Many condemned prisoners had been flogged here as a prelude to the horrific death on the cross. This was the pila verberis.

Tesserarius
(watch commander) Sextus Diocletianus (his family had been freed from slavery under Emperor Diocletian - traditionally, the newly-freed, who had carried no cognomen as slaves, adopted that of the Emperor under which they became free), led his company of legionaries down the country lane north-west of the suburbs of Narbo. They had started well before the early dawn of this August day and, though not hurrying, had made good time.
As they neared their objective, Sextus had troubling thoughts. Not fear, mind you. The man was a veteran of the fabled Legio XIII Gemina, raised by Caesar in the Gallic Wars. This had been the Legion that Caesar chose to take with him when he crossed the Rubicon, which distinguished itself throughout the Civil Wars. Sextus had served twelve years in that legendary body until being dispatched to Narbo when the Legion was sent to Egypt.
cropped-LOGO.jpg
No, Sextus did not know fear of battle. But worry as a leader he could not suppress. Half his men were raw recruits, never exposed to combat. Also serving as Hastiliarius Centuriae (weapons instructor of the Century), Sextus was responsible for the strict training of the men. He prided himself that these men had made significant progress. But they were still untested. And the others were only a little more experienced. As they came closer to possible danger, Sextus repeatedly ordered them to stay in close formation and alert to any danger. He had four of his best men thrown out as exploratores (scouts) to give early warning of any trouble. It could not be much farther to the Goth village.



The Thirteenth Legion has found a place in popular culture in the HBO series Rome. Here is Caesar's speech to the 13th.

The two lead characters in the series, Lucius Vorenus and Titus Pullo, were based on real people. Caesar in Commentarii de Bello Gallico, Book 5, Chapter 44, tells a story of two rival Centurions, by these names, serving in what is believed to be the Legio IX Hispana. "Erant in ea legione fortissimi viri, centuriones, qui primis ordinibus appropinquarent, Titus Pullo et Lucius Vorenus. Hi perpetuas inter se controversias habebant, quinam anteferretur, omnibusque annis de locis summis simultatibus contendebant." They both craved promotion to Primipilus, senior centurion of the first cohort in a Roman legion. Caesar tells of them undertaking a perilous action to impress their superiors. It can be read here: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Commentaries_on_the_Gallic_War/Book_5#44

In modern infantry terms, Primipilus would be considered the senior enlisted man in the legion, though there is no direct equivalent. Only eight officers in a legion outranked him.
 

Fossy

Tribune
Barbara's areolas had puckered with the overnight cool of the convivium, causing the nipples to point tumescently. Now, that cool inside air gave way to the powerful morning rays of the summer sun as Barbara emerged almost naked with her escort into the atrium. The bright sun blinded her for a moment, and she raised her unfettered arms to shield her eyes. The unconsciously sensuous gesture bared her whole front to the lustful audience. Her fair skin, pink and glistening from the recent scrubbing, was only moderately marred by the remaining marks of the previous day's ordeal. From her long straight black hair framing her sweet face, to her full, raised breasts and flat tummy, down to her flared hips, partially covered pussy, and long, shapely thighs and legs, the girl’s body was a stunningly erotic sight.
The crowd of men caught its breath at the enchanting sight. But, today, they did not focus their passion on loving or even the brutal sex of yesterday. No, today, they were anticipating how her body would jump and twist and bleed in the throes of a terrible, cutting assault!

With her eyes now adjusted, Barbara was surprised at the size of the crowd – thirty or forty soldiers, a half dozen men in togas, and another dozen servants – all gathered around under the surrounding porticos – all staring at her with cruel lust.
There was no real resistance left in the beaten girl, but she did stop to look around at this multitude of tormentors. One of the soldiers behind her swung a length of leather into her butt to urge her forward. “Move, meretrix (Move it slut),” he said, urging her toward the center. The girl looked up in terror at the iujum looming above her. She prayed they wouldn’t tie her arms there again - her shoulders still ached from that strain. She sighed with relief when the men steered her past the uprights. Then she saw it in front of her! A thick stake, anchored securely in the ground. The blunt thing was over a passum (five feet) tall and three pedes (feet) in circumference. From the top of the pole, several chains hung. Several more were bolted to the base. The wood, though rough-hewn, looked as if it had been smoothed by much wear. Much of the wood was stained a darker reddish-brown.
This post had been a dreaded fixture in the center of the castra for over a century. Even as soldiers walked by it on their everyday routine, many would shiver at the thought of what this heavy wood post represented. Countless wayward soldiers had been bound here and had their backs flayed. Many condemned prisoners had been flogged here as a prelude to the horrific death on the cross. This was the pila verberis.

Tesserarius
(watch commander) Sextus Diocletianus (his family had been freed from slavery under Emperor Diocletian - traditionally, the newly-freed, who had carried no cognomen as slaves, adopted that of the Emperor under which they became free), led his company of legionaries down the country lane north-west of the suburbs of Narbo. They had started well before the early dawn of this August day and, though not hurrying, had made good time.
As they neared their objective, Sextus had troubling thoughts. Not fear, mind you. The man was a veteran of the fabled Legio XIII Gemina, raised by Caesar in the Gallic Wars. This had been the Legion that Caesar chose to take with him when he crossed the Rubicon, which distinguished itself throughout the Civil Wars. Sextus had served twelve years in that legendary body until being dispatched to Narbo when the Legion was sent to Egypt.
View attachment 992500
No, Sextus did not know fear of battle. But worry as a leader he could not suppress. Half his men were raw recruits, never exposed to combat. Also serving as Hastiliarius Centuriae (weapons instructor of the Century), Sextus was responsible for the strict training of the men. He prided himself that these men had made significant progress. But they were still untested. And the others were only a little more experienced. As they came closer to possible danger, Sextus repeatedly ordered them to stay in close formation and alert to any danger. He had four of his best men thrown out as exploratores (scouts) to give early warning of any trouble. It could not be much farther to the Goth village.



The Thirteenth Legion has found a place in popular culture in the HBO series Rome. Here is Caesar's speech to the 13th.

The two lead characters in the series, Lucius Vorenus and Titus Pullo, were based on real people. Caesar in Commentarii de Bello Gallico, Book 5, Chapter 44, tells a story of two rival Centurions, by these names, serving in what is believed to be the Legio IX Hispana. "Erant in ea legione fortissimi viri, centuriones, qui primis ordinibus appropinquarent, Titus Pullo et Lucius Vorenus. Hi perpetuas inter se controversias habebant, quinam anteferretur, omnibusque annis de locis summis simultatibus contendebant." They both craved promotion to Primipilus, senior centurion of the first cohort in a Roman legion. Caesar tells of them undertaking a perilous action to impress their superiors. It can be read here: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Commentaries_on_the_Gallic_War/Book_5#44

In modern infantry terms, Primipilus would be considered the senior enlisted man in the legion, though there is no direct equivalent. Only eight officers in a legion outranked him.
... Barbara's areolas had puckered with the overnight cool of the convivium, causing the nipples to point tumescently ... what a sight this description conjures! Surely there must be a Latin word for Tumescent?
 
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Praefectus Praetorio

Brother of the Quill
... Barbara's areolas had puckered with the overnight cool of the convivium, causing the nipples to point tumescently ... what a site this description conjures! Surely there must be a Latin word for Tumescent?
The English word derives from Latin, tumere, meaning, to be swollen. Since they were being described, I took my default position and rendered in English. If I were quoting one of the men (Marcus Lycus?) he would have said, "Ecce! Eae papillae tument."
 

Barbaria1

Rebel Leader
Staff member
Barbara's areolas had puckered with the overnight cool of the convivium, causing the nipples to point tumescently. Now, that cool inside air gave way to the powerful morning rays of the summer sun as Barbara emerged almost naked with her escort into the atrium. The bright sun blinded her for a moment, and she raised her unfettered arms to shield her eyes. The unconsciously sensuous gesture bared her whole front to the lustful audience. Her fair skin, pink and glistening from the recent scrubbing, was only moderately marred by the remaining marks of the previous day's ordeal. From her long straight black hair framing her sweet face, to her full, raised breasts and flat tummy, down to her flared hips, partially covered pussy, and long, shapely thighs and legs, the girl’s body was a stunningly erotic sight.
This is getting rather personal. Why is everyone looking at me in that way? :confused:
 

montycrusto

Slave Trader
The English word derives from Latin, tumere, meaning, to be swollen. Since they were being described, I took my default position and rendered in English. If I were quoting one of the men (Marcus Lycus?) he would have said, "Ecce! Eae papillae tument."
I know “tumuli” are little mounds, barrows or earthworks, that’s how they are marked on maps. There’s one in my neck of the marshes called “Wimble Toot” which I always thought very picturesque..
B219B298-E5ED-49A8-BFF8-B1F14EF0DF78.jpeg
 

Praefectus Praetorio

Brother of the Quill

Praefectus Praetorio

Brother of the Quill
A Tesserarius
7f0a50f0015df54700acbb2103dd51dd.jpg
The name came from tessera, a small tile of wood, on which the officer would write the watchwords for the night. Hence the watch commander was named for it. He was third ranking in the centuria, after the Centurio and the Optio.
 
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Praefectus Praetorio

Brother of the Quill
At Mogurix’s direction, the soldiers urged Barbara forward to stand facing the post. The top came up just to her chin. They drew her arms forward around the wood. Chains from the opposite side were wrapped around and hooked to her manacles. This stretched her arms tightly encircling the post, just below the top. The men joked that she appeared to be embracing her lover.
The men took both her feet and spread them about two pedes apart. Short chains attached to rings in the ground were secured to her ankles fetters, keeping them separated. Barb’s face was now against the top of the post as her arms tightly hugged it.
The Optio turned to Calixtus and reported, “Omnis praeparatus est, Centurio (All is ready, Centurion).”

The Centurio approached the Quaestor, sitting with the others. He showed Piso a scourge. “Domine, we recommend a medium flagrum (intermediate scourge). You can see, it has septem notatos crines (seven knotted tails) cum globulos parvos in nodis (with small balls [of lead] in the knots).”
“Yes, I see,” said the Quaestor, hefting the heavy weapon. “Testae ossorum aut fila Metallica (shards of bone or metal wires)?”
“Only brevissima fila (very short wires),” answered Calixtus. He showed the tiny sharp ends protruding from the knots. "hese will be very painful and cause cutting. We believe that you will be satisfied by the profluvio sanguinis (flow of blood) But it is not a scorpio (an enhanced scourge with hooked wire and sharp shards of bone embedded) that would strip the flesh down to her bones within the first dozen strokes.”
Perfectus (perfect)!” responded Piso.

Sextus, as always in the lead, came to the top of a small rise in the path and saw ahead their objective, the Goth encampment. Signaling his men to halt, he called in his exploratores. They reported no unusual activity or threats. Sextus studied the village from a short distance. Men and women moved around performing the routine tasks of everyday life. It seemed tranquil and unremarkable.

The Tesserarius formed his men in a formal parade formation and lead them down into the village.
The sight of thirty fully-armed Roman soldiers marching into their camp caused the Goths to drop whatever they were doing and gather to stare. Sextus, observing with a trained eye, noted no weapons nor aggressive activity. Once they were well into the place, he saw a very tall, older man, accompanied by a retinue of several young men, approach him. The man was poorly dressed in a tattered tunic and trousers but carried himself erect with great dignity. He had fair skin and long, dark-brown hair, and a full mustache. His green eyes flashed with spirit, yet seemed peaceful. The men with him looked defiant but seemed unarmed.

Sextus halted his men and raised his arm in salute. “Ave, Domine.”
The elder halted and raised his hand in the Germanic salute. “Godana maurgin. Waila andanema, (Good Morning, Welcome).” His voice was deep and strong, yet almost gentle.
“Are you the rex (king) here?” asked Sextus.
Rex? No. Not king. I Friþugairns, a reiks of the Gutþiuda (Goths) in this region. In Latin, I am called Fritigernus. You might say I’m the ‘headman.’ Ƕa ist namō þein (what is your name)?”
“Sextus. Faginō in þammei gakunnaida þuk (Pleased to meet you).” Though his Gothic was weak, he hoped it would convey a peaceful intent. He had been ordered to avoid unnecessary fighting.
The reiks was most impressed and pleased to see the soldier attempt to use some Gothic. Most Romans thought it beneath their dignity. Since each knew some of the other’s language, the conversation proceeded.
Sextus explained that a report of unrest in this area had been received. He had been sent to ensure that all was well with the village.
Friþugairns nodded and smiled. He knew the true reason for Roman patrols was to awe the Goths and suppress any dissent. However, he was a believer in peace. His very name meant ‘peace-seeker.’ Therefore he went along with the fiction. He thanked Sextus for the concern and care of the Romans but said everything was calm and peaceful.
Sextus was quite relieved to find no obvious hostility nor armed resistance. He chatted with the headman and was impressed by his sage attitude. Friþugairns, in turn, respected the military bearing and polite approach of the Roman.
 
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Fossy

Tribune
At Mogurix’s direction, the soldiers urged Barbara forward to stand facing the post. The top came up just to her chin. They drew her arms forward around the wood. Chains from the opposite side were wrapped around and hooked to her manacles. This stretched her arms tightly encircling the post, just below the top. The men joked that she appeared to be embracing her lover.
The men took both her feet and spread them about two pedes apart. Short chains attached to rings in the ground were secured to her ankles fetters, keeping them separated. Barb’s face was now against the top of the post as her arms tightly hugged it.
The Optio turned to Calixtus and reported, “Omnis praeparatus est, Centurio (All is ready, Centurion).”

The Centurio approached the Quaestor, sitting with the others. He showed Piso a scourge. “Domine, we recommend a medium flagrum (intermediate scourge). You can see, it has septem notatos crines (seven knotted tails) cum globulos parvos in nodis (with small balls [of lead] in the knots).”
“Yes, I see,” said the Quaestor, hefting the heavy weapon. “Testae ossorum aut fila Metallica (shards of bone or metal wires)?”
“Only brevissima fila (very short wires).” He showed the tiny sharp ends protruding from the knots. These will be very painful and cause cutting. We believe that you will be satisfied by the profluvio sanguinis (flow of blood) But it is not a scorpio (an enhanced scourge with hooked wire and sharp shards of bone embedded) that would strip the flesh down to her bones within the first dozen strokes.”
Perfectus (perfect)!” responded Piso.

Sextus, as always in the lead, came to the top of a small rise in the path and saw ahead their objective, the Goth encampment. Signaling his men to halt, he called in his exploratores. They reported no unusual activity or threats. Sextus studied the village from a short distance. Men and women moved around performing the routine tasks of everyday life. It seemed tranquil and unremarkable.

The Tesserarius formed his men in a formal parade formation and lead them down into the village.
The sight of thirty fully-armed Roman soldiers marching into their camp caused the Goths to drop whatever they were doing and gather to stare. Sextus, observing with a trained eye, noted no weapons nor aggressive activity. Once they were well into the place, he saw a very tall, older man, accompanied by a retinue of several young men, approach him. The man was poorly dressed in a tattered tunic and trousers but carried himself erect with great dignity. He had fair skin and long, dark-brown hair, and a full mustache. His green eyes flashed with spirit, yet seemed peaceful. The men with him looked defiant but seemed unarmed.

Sextus halted his men and raised his arm in salute. “Ave, Domine.”
The elder halted and raised his hand in the Germanic salute. “Godana maurgin. Waila andanema, (Good Morning, Welcome).” His voice was deep and strong, yet almost gentle.
“Are you the rex (king) here?” asked Sextus.
Rex? No. Not king. I Friþugairns, a reiks of the Gutþiuda (Goths) in this region. In Latin, I am called Fritigernus. You might say I’m the ‘headman.’ Ƕa ist namō þein (what is your name)?”
“Sextus. Faginō in þammei gakunnaida þuk (Pleased to meet you).” Though his Gothic was weak, he hoped it would convey a peaceful intent. He had been ordered to avoid unnecessary fighting.
The reiks was most impressed and pleased to see the soldier attempt to use some Gothic. Most Romans thought it beneath their dignity. Since each knew some of the other’s language, the conversation proceeded.
Sextus explained that a report of unrest in this area had been received. He had been sent to ensure that all was well with the village.
Friþugairns nodded and smiled. He knew the true reason for Roman patrols was to awe the Goths and suppress any dissent. However, he was a believer in peace. His very name meant ‘peace-seeker.’ Therefore he went along with the fiction. He thanked Sextus for the concern and care of the Romans but said everything was calm and peaceful.
Sextus was quite relieved to find no obvious hostility nor armed resistance. He chatted with the headman and was impressed by his sage attitude. Friþugairns, in turn, respected the military bearing and polite approach of the Roman.
"... strip the flesh down to her bones within the first dozen strokes ..." - The spectacular end is night for our delectable Goth Slut ... or is it?

Excellent dual narrative PrPr ... as always.
 
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