Jon Smithie
Tribune
Very well written, Kasey! I really admire the intensity and vividness of your writing.
Justine, Juliette and The 120 Days were written with the sadist in mind. The Libertines in each of these books cared nothing for the personal tastes of the victim. In fact I'd go so far as to say, if any of the victims showed any sign of masochistic enjoyment it would probably spur the Libertines on to torture them harder to strip away any evidence of pleasure. The Libertines found ultimate arousal in the utter destruction of the victim and the only sexual gratification they were interested in was their own.
I don't think Justine was a masochist; it doesn't fit the narrative. It was just a tale of torture and abuse from the victims perspective, wereas Juliette was from the perspective of the abuser.
I imagine de Sade did understand what drove female masochistic tendencies, as he was a fantastic philosopher. But, I think he just didn't care when writing the novels in question: they are stories of sadism predominantly and not masochism. Any masochism (that I can remember) in the novels came from the Libertines themselves; all the victims were made to endure unmerciful abuse, pretty much without exception: none of them enjoyed what was happening to them.
The Story Of O featured a willing victim, but in de Sade's novels consentual abuse would have taken away the impact of brutality, and that was clearly what excited him the most.
The scene from Juliette which inspired Whipping For Pleasure left even more an impact on me by the attitudes of Juliette and Clairwil toward the girl. The girl herself was nothing to the two women, and was confirmed by the way they had her whipped to shreds, and after their bloodlust had subsided they asked each other what shall we do next? No remorse or concern for the girl. No conscience. When I first read it, it was a "holy shit!" moment for me....but incredibly erotic.
Being pretty dark and extremely sadistic, that is the kind of writing I crave.
I kind of disagree with a masochistic victim being boring. Surely it would give the sadist the opportunity to use more extreme methods to break his victim; how can that be boring? Push her until all she has left is pain and suffering. Or did you mean the book itself....or the character?
I'm pleased this thread is getting people talking.x
Is one of their slave girls fat?De Sade, female sexuality and masochism… Mama mia. A bit like discussing Brillat-Savarin and bio-friendly agriculture. "Nice” try but won’t work.
Speaking of the world imagined by de Sade and, surely, some of us here: How about daydreaming together? One of my recurring erotic fantasies is about a few sophisticated, jaded upper-class ladies joining for illicit pleasures. Could be in ancient Rome or in any province under Roman rule – with little respect for the population enslaved.
En français ou in Englsih
... and I could be agreeing that too !De Sade, female sexuality and masochism… Mama mia. A bit like discussing Brillat-Savarin and bio-friendly agriculture. "Nice” try but won’t work.
Speaking of the world imagined by de Sade and, surely, some of us here: How about daydreaming together? One of my recurring erotic fantasies is about a few sophisticated, jaded upper-class ladies joining for illicit pleasures. Could be in ancient Rome or in any province under Roman rule – with little respect for the population enslaved.
... and I could be agreeing that too ! Great, darling. English or French or...?
Mmmmmm ! It could be very exciting !!! Writters, take your pens ...
Or canes? Did I mention that sometimes these ladies forget to disinfect the darts?But with whips, erika, and other nice tortures ...
Thank you so much Jon.xVery well written, Kasey! I really admire the intensity and vividness of your writing.